co2 from sea level to 7k feet

[rogthecog]

no changes will occur to the atmopheric pressure inside the bottle, as they are designed to withstand such changes.

[Scott Zuhse]

What are you getting at?

[Sketch]

Before he edited his post he was asking if it would be safe to transport a full Co2 tank from sea level to 7000 feet.

[rogthecog]

Sorry for the confusion gentlemen. i tried to delete the posting all together, but was unable to.

[Sketch]

I find it better to simply edit your original post to include the answer, helps others with the same question to benefit from your post.

[rogthecog]

Thank you for this suggestion Sketch. I will take it to heart, especially since i have been reading up on others posts in order to better educate myself on how to use the jockey box correctly and hopefully troubleshoot any issues that i may encounter along the way.

[rogthecog]

When i first started this thread my question was based on the fact that i was worried about traveling with a co2 bottle from sea level to the 7k foot range as everything in my past experience told me that the air from sea level would expand, and i was scared to have a small explosion of sorts, however the folks at Praxair quickly put that worry to rest.
The reason i am now on this thread again is to ask if anyone can help me understand the dynamics that i will encounter in using my jockey box at this 7k foot elevation, as in searching information of past postings i have read that a jocky box will need between 30-40lbs of applied pressure at sea level, so what does this translate to when i get up in the thin air? Is there a formula that would help me find the ideal gauge pressure at 7k feet? After reading so many posts i am somewhat worried about over pressurizing the keg and killing off all of the carbonation. I am also curious to know if i should bleed off the keg and recharge it at 14lbs each night that we stop using it, or is that pressure also impacted because of the elevation factor.
Once again, any and all information is greatly apprecaited.
rogthecog

[spdbump]

The 30-40 lbs is only being used to push the beer through the coils. 120 ft equals a lot of resistance therefore more pressure to push the beer. I know that elevation plays a factor with normal systems ie kegerators or direct draw systems, but I dont belive that it will effect you in your situation. Being at sea level my self im not sure though.

[Scott Zuhse]

With this type equipment and its application, your pressure is determined by the desired flow speed at the faucet which as Colin pointed out, is going to be in the range of 30-40 PSIG. And yes, at the end of each night, any keg that has this high pressure in the head space will need to be recharged with a lower pressure for storage. Which I assume will be around 38F temperature. The 14 PSIG recharge pressure would be ideal.

Reply to this post if you need brief instructions on how to accomplish this.

[rogthecog]

Thank you for your reply Colin. Your information is greatly appreciated and will be followed.
Mr. Zuhse, please correct me if i am wrong here, as the following is what i think i am supposed to do:
1. shut off my supply valve on the co2 tank, with the coupler in the open position, then pull the releif valve in order to vacate all of the head pressure in the keg, then close the keg coupler.
2. turn off the supply valve to the keg & coupler, then reopen the co2 tank with the gauge set to zero, slowly turning the pressure up to 14lbs,. once that setting has been reached, i then slowly reopen the valve to the coupler, and finally re-engage the keg coupler itself so that the 14lbs of pressure can be reinjected into the keg.
3. disengage the coupler, and shut everything off.
please let me know if i am mistaken.
rogthecog

[Scott Zuhse]

Close!

1. Turn the shut off valve below your regulator to the off position.
2. Readjust your regulator to 14 PSIG.
3. Pulling the safety relief valve on the coupler (coupler is in "on" position), completely relieve the head pressure from the keg.
4. Turn shut off below regulator back to the on position recharging the head pressure to 14 PSI.
5. Uncouple keg and place in refrigeration @ 38F.

[rogthecog]

--update--
So, now that i am back from the 4th in Tahoe and had the opportunity to put all of this knowledge to work, i am here to report the following:
keg was picked up from the corner market all nice and cold. It was promptly placed in a tub on top of 1 large block of dry ice, and finished off with 2 small blocks on the top. the keg and tub were then wrapped with a large beach towel in the hopes it would act as a feeble insulator. After connecting the coupler, the regulator was cleared then set to 30 PSI. and the pressure was then turned on and allowed to charge the keg, and the result was.... foam... this same outcome was reached at 33, 35, and 40 PSI. After loosing the confidence by my two brothers and dad, i then shut off the CO2 supply, pulled the releife valve on the coupler, and turned down the regulator to 5 PSI. the result when restarting the delivery of the CO2 was a slow stream but no foam. the final increase on the reulator was figured out at 12 PSI. and left there for the evening, with perfect pour acheived all night long.
All i could figure is that since the keg came from a distibutor at sea level and then delivered to the corner market, the air mixture used when filling the keg had expanded just as all air from sea level does when taken to 7k ft altitude... either that or the coils i was told are 120ft really arent that long afterall.
rogthecog

[Scott Zuhse]

Fill us in on what you did with the coils. Ice? Ice with a little water? Etc.

Check out the link to a coil box with 120' coils for reference.

[KillianBoy]

rogthecog,
I was hoping someone with more experience would ask but, I gotta ask, who told you to use dry ice for transport? I don't have a jockey box but the store says:

With a 120’ coil cooler, beer can be continuously dispensed from the faucet at 36-38° F even if the keg is at room temperature.

You do understand what a jockey box is meant to do? Buy keg (no need to keep cold) and ice (regular ice), hook up keg to jockey box, run beer through coils and then ice coils (you could do this before hand) and wait for ice to do the job and set PSI as Scott and others said. By using dry ice you dropped temperature of the beer to abnormally low level, especially if used inside the jockey box, once dry ice dissipated, temperature of the beer returned to normal and beer flowed well, I don't think it was altitude problems, just temperature problems, just don't use dry ice next time.
KB
Scott posted before I finished writing mine, but you should post how the dry ice was applied to keg (directly on keg or towel between), also how you applied ice to coils and if dry ice was applied while hooked up to jockey box.

[rogthecog]

Gentlemen,
Know that i appreaciate your feed back and replies.

Mr. Zuhse - i added regular ice halfway up the inside and outside of the coils, then filled with water from the garden hose until the coils were submerged. Please let me know if i was wrong to do so.

KB - The dry ice was added to the tub and smaller portions were placed on the top of the keg once it was inside the garage where it would be dispensed from, not while it was in transit. The reason i did this was because i read elsewhere on this forum that Bud Light is not pasteurized and would spoil quickly if not kept cold the entire time it was in use. Since it was 83-87 degrees the whole time i was in Tahoe, dry ice seemed to be the better solution, as there were only 6 of us drinking from it, and it needed to last freshly for 72 hours. The towel was placed around the keg & tub after the ice was applied in order to act as an insulator, but also as barrier in order to keep bare skin from accidently touching the dry ice.
on a side note... we killed the keg inside 48 hours...LOL

rogthecog