Order $300 in Parts for Avanti... Still have Massive Foam----DIALUP BEWARE!

[rjmcleod24]

Help!!

Just received my package on Friday which included a new dual-gauge premium commercial-grade regulator (which I have to send back because for some reason it leaks around the inlet connector), a temperature control (Johnson Controls), 2 brand new couplers, a SS dual faucet tower with 5ft of line for each, a 2-way air splitter, 5ft of high-grade CO2 hose, and 2 keg temperature/volume strips.

Now I installed everything Saturday afternoon - mounted the 3" dual faucet tower on top which replaced the 2.5" Avanti so I drilled 4 new holes and mounted it appropriately. (The tower cap seals very well BTW - rubber seal around it keeps it secured and tight). I removed the grommet on the back where the air line goes through so I could feed the new air line as well as the temperature gauge line through the new hole, and sealed it off with black duct tape. I mounted the temperature control on the back, and have it set to 38 degrees with a 2 degree offset. Because the new regulator leaked, I had to use my old one (Avanti OEM POS). It seems to have no issues in holding a PSI or leaking, so I'm not sure if it is the problem or not... I still intend on returning (or figuring out) the new one.

So there you have it - dual keg setup, temperature controls set to 38 with a +/- 2, PSI set to 10-12, 5ft of beer lines, brand new tower with dual Perlick faucets.... Bought 2 sixtels yesterday around 4pm, brought them home, and theyve been sitting overnight... I was getting foam yesterday but figured I had to wait it out... wake up this morning and I STILL get massive amounts of foam.

Now I have 2 concerns :

1) The regulator that I previously mentioned. I read that it was recommended to replace it, so it could be the problem in regulating the correct PSI

2) The keg strips on the keg do not seem to indicate that they are at 36-40 degrees... I'm not completely sure how to read these things, but on each level of temp (30, 32, 34, 36, 38 40, 42, 44, 46, etc etc) the little square is shaded in blue. Gets fainter as it goes up, obviously, but it seems that despite sitting overnight with the temp being controller to 38, they are still not cold enough. Am I doing something wrong here??


My big issue is that I have a huge BBQ planned this Saturday with friends from college coming in, work friends, etc, and this is the first time many have seen our new house. This thing has been driving me crazy since August, and I thought throwing $300-400 at it would finally make it work correctly.. but alas.. I'm still sitting here with cups of foam....

PLEASE HELP!! I really appreciate the advice I've received through this board.. I would never have had any idea what a POS my Avanti really was!











FYI: I know in the picture the PSI reads below 10.. I had to do this last night because anything at 10 or above was just shooting beer out the faucet.. way too much pressure and also resulted in a lot of foam, so I turned it down so I could actually draw a few. I have since bumped it back up to just above 10.

[rjmcleod24]

[rjmcleod24]

The temp of the water now on the new "blue box" thermostat is 35 degrees.. there is no way this beer coming out is 35. I want to go pick up a regular glass thermometer from the drug store rather than disassemble the water/thermostat setup in the rubbermaid tub so I can measure the draw temp. of the beer.. will post back..

[ne14vw]

first off i wouldnt rely in those strips. definitely get a food thermometer and take a liquid temp. also try turning the pressure up to 14-16 lbs.
its hard for me to tell, i can see lots of air in the lines (not enough pressure) but are they freezing too?

[ne14vw]

also it looks like those kegs are sweating.. means theyre too warm

[Larry Tapper]

I don't see a blower to cool the tower and move air in the unit.

[ashman]

I would suggest moving the water off of the cold plate as this could be affecting the temp of the water.

[rjmcleod24]

Originally Posted by ne14vw

first off i wouldnt rely in those strips. definitely get a food thermometer and take a liquid temp. also try turning the pressure up to 14-16 lbs.
its hard for me to tell, i can see lots of air in the lines (not enough pressure) but are they freezing too?

If I turn it up to 14-16psi I'm going to have a beer canon shooting beer out the faucet -- thank you for the suggestion but I already turned it up to 15psi to try that and had those exact results..

I do see the air in the lines but didn't really know how to get rid of that except to pour off a pitcher or two... which I did... to no avail...

[rjmcleod24]

Originally Posted by ashman

I would suggest moving the water off of the cold plate as this could be affecting the temp of the water.

I will try this - great suggestion - I didn't think of that before. It could explain why the kegs do not seem cold enough...

Like I said earlier, the water temp read 35 degrees - there was no way the beer coming out was 35.

[edramshaw]

Just my 2 cents....

The reason the beer "shoots" out when the psi is set to the proper 12-14 level is because the beer seems to be too warm. When this happens the 12-14 psi that you have the regualtor set at is secondary to the pressure building up in the keg. When liquid warms is loses the ability to keep the co2 in the liquid. So if you have a beer that should be poured at 14 psi at 38 degrees then at 38 degrees you will have 14 psi in the keg. As the beer warms less can stay disolved in the beer so it build up in the headspace of the keg. This is causing you to experience "shooting" beer. Check the actual temperature of the beer and see if you can get an accurate reading of the temp. Also, be careful of where that probe for the Johnson Controls unit is because that can cause problems, your best bet will be to keep it in the back and possibly submerged in liquid to get a balanced reading. Good luck!

[rjmcleod24]

Originally Posted by edramshaw

Just my 2 cents....

The reason the beer "shoots" out when the psi is set to the proper 12-14 level is because the beer seems to be too warm. When this happens the 12-14 psi that you have the regualtor set at is secondary to the pressure building up in the keg. When liquid warms is loses the ability to keep the co2 in the liquid. So if you have a beer that should be poured at 14 psi at 38 degrees then at 38 degrees you will have 14 psi in the keg. As the beer warms less can stay disolved in the beer so it build up in the headspace of the keg. This is causing you to experience "shooting" beer. Check the actual temperature of the beer and see if you can get an accurate reading of the temp. Also, be careful of where that probe for the Johnson Controls unit is because that can cause problems, your best bet will be to keep it in the back and possibly submerged in liquid to get a balanced reading. Good luck!

Thanks ramshaw.

I am beginning to believe the temperature was not correct. I took the previous poster's advice (whose Avanti setup I admire greatly) and moved the little container of water off the cold plate down on to the "floor" of the fridge. Hopefully this will help it gain a more accurate reading.

Obviously there is something wrong if I have it at 10-12psi and I'm still getting "shooting" beer and a lot of foam.. I really hope I don't waste these two kegs trying to get this right....

What about the Johnson Controls unit though? You have me nervous now that I've done something wrong in setting it up. I have the temp sensor submerged in the little rubbermaid container.. only the metal part of course.. and as state previously I set the whole thing down on the floor.

I suppose I should let the temp controller run its course overnight... and hopefully the temp of the water and the temp of the beer equal out at a cool 38.... Should I take the water out and let it warm up, then set everything back up again? The thought with this is so that I could "start over" with the water and allow the unit to run its course until the water is a guaranteed 38....thus ensuring that the beer is at least 38 or colder... With such a little container of water I figured it would re-cool down to 38 much faster than the beer would freeze...

I'll tell you I never dreamed it was so difficult to get a clean quality pour in your home after spending nearly $1000 when its all said and done...

[rjmcleod24]

Just a side thought... I saw it mentioned previously...

Any thoughts on the air in the lines? Or does this have a lot/something to do with the beer being too warm? Being a constant pressure, I thought the air would eventually be forced out, creating a vacuum of sorts in the lines...

[rjmcleod24]

Ahh and I almost forgot...

Do you all recommend keeping it at 12-14psi despite the "shooting" beer problem? I obviously can't draw any at that setting, which I'm not worried about tonight, but I wasn't sure if this would be the best idea to try and salvage these kegs as much as possible...

At 12-14 or even 10-12 psi, would the "too warm" built-up pressure in the keg subside as the keg eventually cools? Or do I have to keep "bleeding" (air) them to relieve the excess?

Again, I thank you all for your tips. I don't know of any other forums as extensive as this one, and I'd be lost without this!! I hope to be a proud (fully functional) 'rator owner by the end of the week...

[ne14vw]

the air on your lines is because their is not enough pressure..its escaping from the keg itself. before you can use the proper pressure(without over foaming) you have to get the temp right(38 degrees)..even a couple degrees off will make all the difference. my prior statement to try 14-16 was a little over zealous, it depends on the line and elevation your at. i was assuming correct temp and pressure already tried. sorry about the confusion.
i will stand that your issue certainly seems to be temperature related(too warm). in the mean time under compensating the pressure will lead to flat beer

i would put a glass of cold water inside the kegerator right now, after a couple few hours go to any grocery store and spend 8 bucks on a thermometer, check the liquid temp and go from there

[rjmcleod24]

Originally Posted by ne14vw

the air on your lines is because their is not enough pressure..its escaping from the keg itself. before you can use the proper pressure(without over foaming) you have to get the temp right(38 degrees)..even a couple degrees off will make all the difference. my prior statement to try 14-16 was a little over zealous, it depends on the line and elevation your at. i was assuming correct temp and pressure already tried. sorry about the confusion.
i will stand that your issue certainly seems to be temperature related(too warm). in the mean time under compensating the pressure will lead to flat beer

i would put a glass of cold water inside the kegerator right now, after a couple few hours go to any grocery store and spend 8 bucks on a thermometer, check the liquid temp and go from there

Thank you again. I'm trying desperately to tackle this temperature issue...

I removed the rubbermaid container and refilled it with lukewarm water from the tap... when I first put it in it read 85 degrees, so I figured this time the kegs would certainly cool down to 38 (since theyve been in there 24+ hours) by the time the water cooled back down to 38....

Just checked the temp and the water is reading THIRTY-FIVE degrees!! And still getting foam!

This is becoming extremely frustrating at this point...

[mhabby]

4 observations about your setup:

1) No blower. You need to get cold air to tower. Regardeless of keg temp, the beer in the line in tower and shank will quickly warm above 40 degrees. You do not mention if only your first pour is foamy, or if you pour 10 cups in a row and they are all foamy. You invested some money in your kegerator, I'd spring for the blower as well.

2) Your co2 lines appear in photos to have some serious kinks in them. Is this just the photo, or are the lines getting pinched between the kegs?

3) Don't know if this can affect anything, but your CO2 splitter appears to be mounted on cooling plate at rear of kegerator, and appears to be iced up. I mounted my splitter on the side of kegerator.

4) Lastly, check your faucets. There is often a tiny hole on the underside that at times can get clogged.

[ne14vw]

well, if you have tackled the problem with the t-stat by moving the temp gage,
and you believe the fridge is now putting out the proper temp..just be aware that it can take some time for a 5 gallon keg to cool, certainly longer than a couple of ounces..
if you still think the fridge is warm, i would just try turning the control down a few degrees at a time until the poured beer is 38..regardless of the what the temp gage says...
also realize that not having a cooled tower is definitely going to create the beer in that section of line to warm, so until that is fixed you are always going to have pour off..

[rjmcleod24]

Originally Posted by mhabby

4 observations about your setup:

1) No blower. You need to get cold air to tower. Regardeless of keg temp, the beer in the line in tower and shank will quickly warm above 40 degrees. You do not mention if only your first pour is foamy, or if you pour 10 cups in a row and they are all foamy. You invested some money in your kegerator, I'd spring for the blower as well.

2) Your co2 lines appear in photos to have some serious kinks in them. Is this just the photo, or are the lines getting pinched between the kegs?

3) Don't know if this can affect anything, but your CO2 splitter appears to be mounted on cooling plate at rear of kegerator, and appears to be iced up. I mounted my splitter on the side of kegerator.

4) Lastly, check your faucets. There is often a tiny hole on the underside that at times can get clogged.

1) I plan on eventually going to a blower setup .. I just don't have the time or money right now. I see others with similar setups as mine (without a blower) without any problems.

2) I made sure they didn't have any kinks in them.. or at least I tried. They do look rather twisted about, but I don't believe there are any kinks. I was pretty strict with the amount of house I gave to each lead, so there isn't much room for them to kink. The beer lines are another story... they are all over the place since they are so long, and if I'm not careful I could easily pinch one.

3) Not sure if this affects anything either... any thoughts anyone? It is only iced over because it is mounted right to the cold plate.... I chose to mount the splitter inside because I wouldn't be able to fit 2 CO2 air lines and the temperature sensor lead through the hole in the back of the Avanti.. I guess I could try, but like the previous point, I didn't want to pinch the lines by jamming them through.

4) I'm sure these faucets are fine. Both are brand new out of the box.. though I won't rule out anything. Not sure I really see the hole on the underside though?

[rjmcleod24]

Originally Posted by ne14vw

well, if you have tackled the problem with the t-stat by moving the temp gage,
and you believe the fridge is now putting out the proper temp..just be aware that it can take some time for a 5 gallon keg to cool, certainly longer than a couple of ounces..
if you still think the fridge is warm, i would just try turning the control down a few degrees at a time until the poured beer is 38..regardless of the what the temp gage says...
also realize that not having a cooled tower is definitely going to create the beer in that section of line to warm, so until that is fixed you are always going to have pour off..

Not convinced that I have tackled the problem. I took everyone's advice last night and moved the rubbermaid container (temp gauge).. As you said it could take some time, so when I get home from work today, I'll check again. As stated previous, I set the temp controls to as low as it could go without freezing the water... aka I set it to 33... I will bring a glass therm. home to test the draw temperature of the beer tonight. I assume it is possible that the Johnson Controls is not calibrated correctly? I didn't even think of that... Could explain why I have the setpoint at 38 and still have 'warm' beer...

Has anyone ever heard of the Avanti being such a gigantic POS that it can't actually cool the unit that low?? Down to 38? I mean the thing was running almost all night... I don't know what else to do if I get home and I'm still dealing with 40-50 degree beer....

[ashman]

Could the new themostat be programed in celcius?? There seems to be ice on the cold plate in back so it looks like the unit is cold enough.