Question about Danby Kegerator with Johnson Controls

[Donutz]

I followed PISMO10's mod for adding the Johnson control that I found on Thread: Danby Kegerator Improvements Part II Item #49. The first day it wasn't getting too cold, but it was chopping away at the temperature trying to cool it. The next day, I noticed that it was at 35 degrees and I had the Johnson control set at 34 degrees... so this brought a nice big smile to my face. I checked it the next day and it was back at 51 degrees. I kept checking it and it will go to about 44 or so... but it doesn't seem to be controlling it like I was expecting. I noticed that the internal fans will be turned off sometimes when they should be running. I followed the instructions to the T. I added an extra cord and clipped it onto the red slide clip on the compressor. I plugged the extra cord into the Johnson control cord and then plugged that into the outlet. It seems as though the kegerator (DKC644BLS) is still using the internal thermostat to determine weather or not the fans should be turned on. Is there a fix for this? Is there something I can do to get better control?

In addition to doing the above mod, I also swapped out the little fan on the top right of the Danby with an 80mm fan. I also added a blower and a line to push the cold air up into the tower.
I have the Johnson control temp prob at the very top of the keg.

[KillianBoy]

Donutz,
I assume you have the Danby plugged in and the JC ETC is set on default (cut-out at setpoint and 5 degree differential), so unit will run to 34, turn off and when probe temperature gets to 39, will turn on.
OK, you don't have to create a weather system in kegerator, the original fan would have been sufficient, could be probe is in the path of the 80MM fan (or tower cooler) and not really getting warmer (which would kick unit back on).
I'd disconnect tower cooler, place sensor out of the way of the fan and make sure the unit is airtight (no wires between seal and unit, if you do seal with tape).
Another member has had problems with this modification, hope this is read by all, ETC will not make unit run colder, it just keeps thing more stable (if set right). No matter if ETC or stock thermostat, unit will run at max cold temperature, cold plate will radiate at 20-25 degrees, once the sensor hits the setpoint, compressor will turn off. From what I gather, again I am no Danby expert just electrically inclined, the ETC will turn off Danby, which includes fan, compressor and display, when the setpoint is hit, unit and compressor will kick on, then run to setpoint. Could be the sensor is being influenced by the fans you have hooked up, don't know, but this is where too much might be bad.
Next post, please post cycle times (compressor on, compressor off), if you have beer inside, beer temperature, if not throw a 1-5 gallon bucket and check every 24 hours.
KB

[Donutz]

Donutz,
I assume you have the Danby plugged in and the JC ETC is set on default (cut-out at setpoint and 5 degree differential), so unit will run to 34, turn off and when probe temperature gets to 39, will turn on.
OK, you don't have to create a weather system in kegerator, the original fan would have been sufficient, could be probe is in the path of the 80MM fan (or tower cooler) and not really getting warmer (which would kick unit back on).
I'd disconnect tower cooler, place sensor out of the way of the fan and make sure the unit is airtight (no wires between seal and unit, if you do seal with tape).
Another member has had problems with this modification, hope this is read by all, ETC will not make unit run colder, it just keeps thing more stable (if set right). No matter if ETC or stock thermostat, unit will run at max cold temperature, cold plate will radiate at 20-25 degrees, once the sensor hits the setpoint, compressor will turn off. From what I gather, again I am no Danby expert just electrically inclined, the ETC will turn off Danby, which includes fan, compressor and display, when the setpoint is hit, unit and compressor will kick on, then run to setpoint. Could be the sensor is being influenced by the fans you have hooked up, don't know, but this is where too much might be bad.
Next post, please post cycle times (compressor on, compressor off), if you have beer inside, beer temperature, if not throw a 1-5 gallon bucket and check every 24 hours.
KB

I have the Danby plugged into the wall and I have the extension wire (that is run to the compressor), plugged into the JC which is plugged into the wall (it is the analog controller and it is just the stock settings) The internal fans seem to be controlled by the Danby and now the compressor is controlled by the JC. I haven't been around enough to watch/measure the compressor cycles. The 80 mm fan is set down on the bottom shelf. The Danby probe is sitting on top of the keg on the rubber handles, and the tower chiller is run up into the tower with tape blocking the air from coming back out of the tower. So the probe itself should just be measuring the air temperature and not getting into the path of the "wind". I have checked the temp of the water and it is only getting to 49 degrees. Now that I read what you said, I'm starting to wonder if my new fan is blowing on the Danby probe which is shutting the fans off and the compressor is just running but now no air is moving...

[Donutz]

One other thing that I'd like to mention. Before I added the JC controller, it seemed as though the chiller plate would get all frosted over and then it would go to defrost. Now that I have wired in the JC, it seems to not get frosted over very often... if not at all. It will start freezing the condensation on the top of it and before it gets too far along, it seems to start to thaw again...

[psychodad]

Pismo's wiring seems to be simpler if followed, and should work. Your description of how you have it wired is hard to follow as written. Killionboy I think is further confusing people. Just slow down and back up.

I'm not going to go back an read Pismo's post again, but I seem to remember he is running the compressor only off of the new controller. After that, the Danby control is going to be only controlling the fan which you don't need if you've added a tower cooler.

[Donutz]

Pismo's wiring seems to be simpler if followed, and should work. Your description of how you have it wired is hard to follow as written. Killionboy I think is further confusing people. Just slow down and back up.

I'm not going to go back an read Pismo's post again, but I seem to remember he is running the compressor only off of the new controller. After that, the Danby control is going to be only controlling the fan which you don't need if you've added a tower cooler.

Sorry for the confustion. The extension wire that I added was just connecting the one wire (from the small prong on the plug) to where the red wire was connected to the compressor, the other two wires on the plug are just capped. Then I plug the new wire into the JC controller and plug the controller into the wall.

You are saying that I don't need a fan if I have a tower cooler? I have the blower closed and capped so that all the air it produces goes into the tower and no where else.

The plate doesn't seem to be getting as cold as it should be though.

[psychodad]

Even though the tower cooler only goes into the tower, the air has to go so,we here which is back out the bottom of the tower. That's all the air circulation you need.

If I'm following how you have the wires, I assume you didn't break the original neutral connection to the compressor. But if you did, this could be causing some of your problems. Also only using one wire suggests the ground prong isn't being used between the JC and the Danby, although the Danby ground should still be intact.

If you can posts some pictures of what you did perhaps that would help.

[psychodad]

I looked at Pismo's post. From what I see, it should work as he described.

[Donutz]

That sounds good. It may be a day or so before I'm able to get to open it up and take pics and post them... but I'll try to do so as soon as possible. This is the instructions that I followed to the T: "I put a slide on clip on the black wire of a new power cord (an old computer cord I had), I then remove the red wire slide on clip from the compressor (it comes down from the control board) and attached my new power cord to the same tab the clip goes on to on the compressor. The compressor now has it's own power cord/supply. This new cord I plugged into a JC external thermostat, placed the temp sensor in through the pre-made hole in the back of the Danby 645 and was good to go. The temp is now controlled solely by the JC external thermostat. Both the main cord and my new cord are plugged into the same outlet as to make sure the polarity is correct"
So, if when you say break the neutral connection... I guess you are talking about when I removed the red wire from the compressor to install the new wire??? The old red wire that was there orig., I just pulled it off from the clip and wrapped it with electrical tape. Put a new clip on the new cord and slid it on where the old wire was. (I know that was confusing how I just said it...) So I will try to get pictures up ASAP. When get home from work, I will try disconnecting my 80 MM fan so there will be NO fans running inside except for the tower chiller and I will remove the tape from the bottom of the tower so the air can get back out. With that being said, where should I place the temperature probe? I would assume on top of the keg would be the worst place since the air will be coming back out of the tower...

[KillianBoy]

Donutz,
I think the confusion remark was pointed at me mainly, I kinda do things like that. The main reason I say just run fan and disconnect the tower cooler is what happened to you, an improperly installed or made tower cooler can cause more problem than it solves.
By blocking the return flow, you basically are sending ALL cold air to tower, ignoring the kegerator itself, that is why you have serious temperature problems. Cold plate super cools air around cold plate this cold drops to bottom, this is what keeps keg/interior cold, not the proximity of cold plate to keg. I think I've tried taking temperatures before of area next to keg without real air circulation and it will vary from 25 degrees at bottom to 50 degrees at top.
Up to you what you want to do, tower cooler OR fan, as psychodad said. I always suggest to start with a fan, you really can't screw up a fan, unlike a tower cooler, which takes a lot of tweaking to get right. Once you get proper air circulation, you'll see the interior temperature stabilize.
KB

[Donutz]

I don't know if this will show up or not, but this is the tower cooler I installed: Coldtower Kegerator Super Beer Tower Cooler w Tap Cover Universally Compatible | eBay

When I get home, I will do as I said earlier. Just remove the fan from the equation and unblock the bottom of the tower and let it run. I still don't understand why the chiller plate is having condensation on it and not freezing though. Before I did the compressor wire with the JC, it seemed to get frost on it a decent bit. After installing that stuff, it got REALLY cold once and since then it seems to not want to get as cold.... Again, maybe it is because of the fans and such. After I do my change tonight, I will see what it is doing in the morning and report tomorrow.

[KillianBoy]

Donutz,
This is basically how I built mine, blower fan, box and hose, differences are his has on/off switch, I have adjustable voltage. Biggest problem with the Ebay special is instructions that you turn on only when drinking beer and power of unit. Circulation should be close to 24/7 as possible and too much CFM can be a problem.
When you said "shutting the fans off", I thought that you have both fan and tower cooler hooked up to old fan power. If you have the tower cooler set up like I read on Ebay, the AC connection should be hooked up to constant power and turned on when needed ( I have my tower cooler set up to run for about 19 hours via a timer), unless you shut it off it shouldn't be turning off.
"I will remove the tape from the bottom of the tower so the air can get back out.", is exactly how you solve temperature problem. Basically you are sending all the cold air away from plate, plate then cools warm air (not the normal cold air), going up tower and not cooling kegerator. The cold plate is struggling to keep up and may not seem cold because environment is warm, you NEED to circulate air if you run a tower cooler, by closing off the return you are just cooling off shank and faucet and not kegerator.
KB

[Donutz]

KB,
I was running BOTH fans on a constant voltage 24/7. That wasn't working. For NOW, just for S#ITS and Giggles, I un-taped the tower cooler. I also turned it off via the switch. Now, I only have the 80mm fan running and the temp controller. I want to start eliminating things until I bring everything under control. If I have to, I will install the original little fan that is stock and only have the temp controller (currently, the tower is the last of my concerns). Once I get the kegerator stabilized and working as it should, I will then start exploring tower cooling and correct placement of the JC probe. So, for right now, I only have the 80 mm fan running, which is placed on the lower shelf and the JC set to 34 degrees. When I started this, it was 50 degrees inside and the plate had formed ice on the top of it and the bottom was still wet.

[KillianBoy]

Donutz,
Posting accurate information helps us help you, you posted:
"I'm starting to wonder if my new fan is blowing on the Danby probe which is shutting the fans off and the compressor is just running but now no air is moving"
This is why I thought you had a homemade tower cooler, so 24/7, no turning off, OK, I got it.

Your post, "currently, the tower is the last of my concerns", is accurate as you can get. First air circulation, which will stabilize the temperature, then worry about the 1st beer foam later.
I have in my newbie thread, take things one at a time, ETC (small fan was enough), stable, then worry about 1st beer foam with tower cooler, when you start adding several things at one time, you don't know what is causing the problem.
Leave the 80mm, hang sensor right over keg or place in right/front corner.
You don't have to un-tape, if you turn it off, once cold plate starts getting cold and running right water should stop, but again that might be symptom of moist air getting in through a hole somewhere.
Also if you haven't changed the cut-in/cut-out, you make it cut in at 37 and have a differential of 3, I think this is the normal most members that use air read sensor.
KB

[psychodad]

If I'm taking it you blocked the bottom of the tower to not let the air back out, that is part of your problem. Run the tube all the way to the back of the shank and leave the bottom open. Run the tower cooler constantly. This will cool the tower and keep the air moving adequately. BTW, I used to delete the eBay links to the tower coolers, but this one looks to be better than the one some yahoo kept ripping people off with.

Just attach the temperature probe somewhere on the side near the top away from the cold plate. This will be fine and keep it out of the way so you don't have to fight it changing kegs out.

One last quick and dirty test you can do, plug your cord you have connected between the compressor and the external control directly into the same outlet as the Danby. This should bypass the external control and run the compressor uncontrolled, if so, your neutral connections are fine and any other control problems would appear to be in the controller setup or bad controller.