M@'s keg system

[M@(tm)]

#1: I've been poking around here for a couple days - and am devoting myself to reading FAQ's and other's posts.

#2: My goal is to add a tap to an existing bar

#3: I bow down and proclaim, "I'm not Worthy" to all the experts I've already read so much from

#4: I've got a friend willing to help me who want's to build a box under the bar with styrofoam insulation - and ideas about not even needing a cooling system beyond a block of ice every couple weeks

#5: I was a home brewer in a previous life - specifically before I procreated - and will be assuming that role again after this tap project is complete. This is important as it means I own a Co2 system, a few kegs + taps, and know what force carb means etc.

Like other forums I frequent: It seems you folks are into pix - I fully understand this - so without further a due- I present my Bar and humbly request suggestions on how to achieve the stated goal of beer on tap. One tap minimum - I'd be a fool not to run lines and make space for 2+.

I have some ideas of my own, some desires etc - but am saving myself from ridicule by waiting for untarnished opine from y'all.

I've got the whole thing modeled in sketch up etc... and I guess I'll throw out one piece of info - the current fridge isn't tall enough to hold the Long Trail keg + tap I will probably start with.

Thanks!
M@

[shuggy]

First off I wouldn't let the friend referenced in #4 anywhere near the project. With an idea like that no good could come of him being involved.

The look and layout of your bar is too nice to go chopping into it so I would look to do some sort of remote dispense either through the wall behind the bar or from the basement through the floor. It's hard to tell from the pictures but you may even have enough room to put a converted chest freezer directly behind the bar without it being too much clutter.

I think you should go with the option that will give you the most taps (3+) and still be feasible/visually appealing. I built my bar before I started homebrewing and I certainly wish I would have made room for more than two taps. My bar is already in the basement and up against an outside wall. At least you've got some options.

By the way, what is that in picture 16? It looks like a sankey tap coming out the top of a corny keg but I've never seen anything like it.

[cubby_swans]

I'm going to second that about your friend's suggestion. There is no way a block of ice could keep a keg cool enough... for weeks? There's a reason people use refrigerators now instead of using blocks of ice like they did 75 years ago.

[M@(tm)]

The bar is right over a deep garage, there's room for a fridge there, but I worry it'll freeze the lines in the winter. Going to look into putting a fridge in the basement side of things - but it might go above the 5ft limit for line cooling.

M@

[cubby_swans]

Is the garage attached, and below the house, under ground level (mostly?). If so, it shouldn't freeze. I keep my kegerator in an an attached garage that's at ground level, and we have sustained near zero temperatures here (days at a time). It's never made my beer colder than the 36 I normally serve it at. You would have the lines going from the fridge to the bar insulated.

[M@(tm)]

The garage is attached, below ground for the most part. I measured though, and a fridge in the garage would require a 8.5 footline for a small fridge. A full size fridge would require just about a 6.5 foot line.

Does this mean a basement solution is going to require an expensive cooling system for the line?

M@

[M@(tm)]

Originally Posted by shuggy

By the way, what is that in picture 16? It looks like a sankey tap coming out the top of a corny keg but I've never seen anything like it.

Not sure what it's called, but it's the tap I needed to run my Co2 system to the Long Trail corny keg. It also fits standard kegs - so if that's a sankey, then that's a sankey on a corny. That's almost as much fun as saying fuggles.

M@

[cubby_swans]

Originally Posted by M@(tm)

The garage is attached, below ground for the most part. I measured though, and a fridge in the garage would require a 8.5 footline for a small fridge. A full size fridge would require just about a 6.5 foot line.

Does this mean a basement solution is going to require an expensive cooling system for the line?

M@

As long as you don't have a bunch of right angle turns in the run, an air cooled blower solution should work for an 8.5' or 6.5' run. You just need a blower with a bit more horsepower than the cheap PC fans many use for short 3 or 4 foot runs. But with an attached below ground garage, I don't think you need to worry about freezing anything. You would insulate the exterior of the beer line run.

[kzad]

My freezer is in my basement. I put it on stacked cement blocks to get it as close to the floor joists as possible, for the shortest possible run. Every little bit helps.

[shuggy]

Originally Posted by M@(tm)

Not sure what it's called, but it's the tap I needed to run my Co2 system to the Long Trail corny keg. It also fits standard kegs - so if that's a sankey, then that's a sankey on a corny. That's almost as much fun as saying fuggles.

M@

Could you take a picture of the top of that keg? I'm assuming it's just a normal 1/6 barrel but I've never seen one with a black top and bottom to look like a corny.

As far as your project goes I would certainly go with the basement remote dispense. Your distance is fine for a blower setup. Get a full size fridge or a chest freezer w/temp control. You're gonna want the extra space once you start brewing again. Get as many taps as you can up to that bar. You'll thank me later. I've got a 1/4 of Yeungling and 3 cornies full of homebrew but only 2 taps at my bar. I wanna bang my head against the wall everytime I have to go to my garage fridge to pour a pint from a stupid picnic tap.

[M@(tm)]

Originally Posted by shuggy

Could you take a picture of the top of that keg? I'm assuming it's just a normal 1/6 barrel but I've never seen one with a black top and bottom to look like a corny.

Please find picture here

I also added an image of the sketchup plan for the system... I had envisioned a kegerator sized fridge... but am scouring craigslist (which turned up 2 full kegerators <$400) for bigger refrigeration.

M@

[M@(tm)]

Scored a $50 fridge for the garage right under the bar. It's your basic fridge with the interior coils exposed on the top of the fridge unit.

So next question = Can I run the lines through the freezer, or should I build the blower in the lower refrigeration section and insulate through the freezer?

I will search for the answer in the forums.

EDIT: did d ton of searching and didn't find an answer to the question: On a standard fridge, freezer on top, should I run the beer line through the freezer portion of the fridge? Review of the beginning of this post will show my project is running a beer line from a garage under my bar. About 6 ft' long straight up, no turns.

M@

[M@(tm)]

Failed to find the answer anywhere here... and spent a LOT of time researching the location of the coils in the fridge. Thought I knew there were none in the roof of the freezer compartment... drilled a small test hole... felt around - didn't find any.

Started drilling the hole with the cirular bit - and just as it got through the sheet metal I got the HISSS

So - I'm out a fridge. My advice to the next guy would be to run the line out the side or something.

M@

[Jay1]

Your safest bet is always the door.......

[M@(tm)]

Aquired a freezer chest for $80 - it hold more kegs and looks nicer than the old fridge (rest in pieces) but will add a good 3ft of line to the project. Gonna hook her up tonight I think.

M@

[bard]

I see several areas in and around your bar that a nice stand alone kegerator should fit.